On this “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan” broadcast, moderated by Margaret Brennan:
- Nationwide Financial Council director Kevin Hassett
- Sen. Mark Warner, Democrat of Virginia
- Sen. Roger Marshall, Republican of Kansas
- Sen. Tammy Duckworth, Democrat of Illinois
- CBS Information director of elections and surveys Anthony Salvanto
Click on right here to browse full transcripts from 2025 of “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan.”
MARGARET BRENNAN: I am Margaret Brennan in Washington.
And this week on Face the Nation: A not-so-hot jobs report results in extra uncertainty in regards to the power of the economic system. With Friday’s jobs report exhibiting a fair foggier forecast for American shoppers than anticipated, President Trump referred to as on his chief financial adviser, Kevin Hassett, to clarify.
(Start VT)
KEVIN HASSETT (Director, Nationwide Financial Council): Proper now, we’re puzzled in regards to the BLS numbers and in search of new management there to make it in order that the numbers are extra dependable.
(Finish VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: However can these unbiased businesses, the Bureau of Labor Statistics and the Federal Reserve, preserve their independence in gentle of political stress? We’ll ask Kevin Hassett and get his tackle the state of the economic system.
Plus, because the circle of critics grows in the case of HHS Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s dealing with of vaccines and administration of the CDC, we are going to speak to Republican Senator Roger Marshall. And the highest Democrat on the Senate Intelligence Committee, Mark Warner, may also be part of us to weigh in on the information of the week.
Lastly, as President Trump strikes to rebrand the Protection Division because the Division of Battle and continues to warn town of Chicago he’ll quickly ship in federal forces, we are going to speak to Illinois Democratic Senator Tammy Duckworth.
It is all simply forward on Face the Nation.
Good morning, and welcome to Face the Nation.
We start this morning with the director of the Nationwide Financial Council, Kevin Hassett.
Good morning, and thanks for being right here…
KEVIN HASSETT: Good morning. It is nice to be right here.
MARGARET BRENNAN: … in particular person.
KEVIN HASSETT: Sure.
MARGARET BRENNAN: There’s loads to get to with you, however I need to begin on what simply occurred in a single day.
Russia has launched a really important assault on Ukraine and – in Kyiv. They really even hit a Ukrainian authorities constructing. Does the U.S. condemn the assault? And what are you ready for now by way of triggering these sanctions on Russia?
KEVIN HASSETT: Properly, as you recognize, I am not one of many overseas coverage advisers of the president, however on the Nationwide Financial Council, we’re liable for ensuring that sanctions get enforced and that individuals which can be serving to Russia with their conflict towards Ukraine, as, for instance, India has been doing by – excuse me – by shopping for Russian oil, that we’re prepared to reply to them economically.
And, you recognize, final evening’s information could be very disappointing, and I am positive that there is going to be a number of speak right now and tomorrow in regards to the stage of sanctions and the timing of sanctions.
MARGARET BRENNAN: The timing of further sanctions on Russia?
KEVIN HASSETT: Maybe, sure. I imply, it is as much as the president ultimately, however, sure, it is a very disappointing set of affairs.
MARGARET BRENNAN: On the U.S. economic system, there have been 22,000 jobs added final month. The previous two months of knowledge have been additionally revised down.
You’ve got stated in interviews this week it suggests there’s much less momentum right here than you thought. Has job creation stalled, and will the Federal Reserve be involved in regards to the jobs image?
KEVIN HASSETT: Proper.
Properly – properly, to begin with, the fascinating factor in regards to the jobs numbers, proper, is that that they had the most important revisions in 50 years over the summer time, and we got here in with 22,000 in August. However should you take a look at what they stated in ’23 and ’24, they’ve two methods of estimating the roles.
There’s one thing referred to as the payroll survey, the place they ask the employers how many individuals did you rent? Then they’ve one thing referred to as the family survey, the place they name up folks, they are saying, do you – do you will have a job?
MARGARET BRENNAN: Proper.
KEVIN HASSETT: And over these two years, the payroll numbers stated that we created 4.5 million jobs and the family survey stated about two million fewer, about 2.5 million jobs. And they need to have the identical reply.
And so, for August, for instance, the payroll survey stated 22,000 and the family survey stated 288,000. And so I feel that what is going on on is that these old school methods of surveying – like, I ponder should you’ve ever gotten a survey within the mail and stuffed it out and mailed it again in. Possibly you will have.
However I feel that that is the best way they’re attempting to do it. And the explanation we’re getting these huge revisions and these numbers that do not make sense is admittedly that we have to modernize the best way we do the labor knowledge.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Proper.
KEVIN HASSETT: However should you take a look at the non-labor knowledge, you recognize, second- quarter GDP was revised as much as 3.3 %. The Atlanta Fed’s GDP estimate for the third quarter proper now could be 3 %. And so industrial manufacturing is at an all-time excessive.
MARGARET BRENNAN: However you consider all that knowledge? All these fashions are functioning?
KEVIN HASSETT: And so – no, the purpose is, when there’s dissonance in knowledge, that you must form of watch the way it all works out.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Bought it.
KEVIN HASSETT: And the factor that I am most suspicious of proper now by way of knowledge high quality is the job quantity, partially as a result of there are different methods to do it. There’s this firm referred to as Homebase that does it. Their August quantity is 15.
However, once more, even take into consideration this. If we ask households what number of jobs have they got, it is plus 288,000 in August. If we ask the employers, it is 22,000. Then that is – that turns into a puzzle for economists. Like, what’s flawed with the info? And we form of know what’s flawed with the info. What’s flawed with the info is, folks aren’t filling out the varieties and sending within the surveys.
MARGARET BRENNAN: As a result of, final month, the president fired the top of the Bureau of Labor Statistics, suggesting there was political bias, not simply what you are speaking about, which is a really technical problem on how knowledge is collected and crunched.
KEVIN HASSETT: Proper.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Did you repair the political bias or…
KEVIN HASSETT: Properly – there – there – there are patterns of the info that appear like political bias, however they might be unintended. And that is why we have to get a brand new set of eyes in there to make it possible for issues are extra clear, that we modernize the surveys and we make them in order that extra folks belief them.
However take into consideration this. On the Federal Reserve…
MARGARET BRENNAN: So you do not belief these numbers from Friday?
KEVIN HASSETT: I feel the BLS numbers want to actually be improved. They must be modernized.
And I gave a chat on the BLS subsequent to Alan Greenspan we had a couple of years in the past the place I talked in regards to the necessity of modernizing them, and so I nonetheless agree with that place.
MARGARET BRENNAN: However, pattern line-wise, once we hear from firms like Caterpillar, Deere, Ford, Procter & Gamble that their prices are going up attributable to tariffs, that does not counsel there’s going to be sturdy hiring in these sectors, proper, when an organization is taking over one thing that might damage their productiveness – or profitability, I ought to say.
KEVIN HASSETT: Properly, we have seen inflation has come down fairly a bit. It was within the excessive 3’s when President Trump took workplace. The common over the six months is 1. 9.
And, you recognize, even the Fed proper now clearly agrees that inflation has been underneath management should you consider futures markets, as a result of the federal funds futures markets are actually saying the Fed goes to chop rates of interest thrice this 12 months.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Anticipated…
(CROSSTALK)
KEVIN HASSETT: And so the Fed – they’re anticipated to. And so, due to this fact, you recognize, the Fed is predicted to really feel prefer it’s snug with the place inflation is correct now.
MARGARET BRENNAN: However my level being that does not forecast from these firms a situation by which they’d essentially be hiring. Have you ever been capable of calculate what the immigration crackdown has accomplished to employment?
KEVIN HASSETT: Properly, sure, there are – there are a few issues that we might take a look at. To start with, the non-public sector employment is up by about half-a-million this 12 months, and authorities employees, authorities employment is down by about 100,000.
There’s one other factor, is that many of the jobs which were created within the U.S. are for native-born employees, and so they’ve really – there’s really been a discount in labor provide for non-native-born employees. And the opposite…
MARGARET BRENNAN: How do you show that?
KEVIN HASSETT: Excuse me?
MARGARET BRENNAN: How do you show that?
(CROSSTALK)
KEVIN HASSETT: Oh, now we have a – now we have a survey the place they really ask it. Now, perhaps we do not belief the surveys, proper?
MARGARET BRENNAN: Proper.
KEVIN HASSETT: And there may be really a factor…
MARGARET BRENNAN: And if you recognize the companies are hiring undocumented or have a sample of it, are you prosecuting these firms?
KEVIN HASSETT: There – there’s technicalities that – when somebody’s launched into the nation, then, within the earlier administration, then they’d typically get a quantity that will permit them to work legally till they went to court docket. And so there have been, for positive, those that have been undocumented…
MARGARET BRENNAN: However going after the employers?
KEVIN HASSETT: … who have been with the ability to work.
However the different factor that you may see within the knowledge, as a result of we get the unemployment insurance coverage claims by, like, county, that about 80 % of the claims for unemployment over the previous few months have come from blue states. And so there are locations like Portland and Chicago the place persons are fleeing the cities, and also you’re seeing that within the numbers too.
MARGARET BRENNAN: However you do not plan to prosecute firms who had this sample you are speaking about of hiring folks within the nation illegally?
KEVIN HASSETT: I do not work for the Justice Division, however – however I do see the sample of native-born versus non-native-born employment.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Properly, we’re additionally seeing in that knowledge you say you do not belief essentially that it is manufacturing that is trade-related, that that’s the place the dearth of hiring is going on. These are the areas that the president had promised there can be new jobs.
When do these new jobs in these sectors come?
KEVIN HASSETT: Proper. Let’s give it some thought once more although that by way of the best way that the info are a bit irritating for everybody proper now, that industrial manufacturing is at an all-time excessive, GDP is booming, productiveness was up 3.8 % within the final quarter, and it appears like manufacturing jobs are down.
And so how is it that industrial manufacturing is at an all-time excessive whereas manufacturing employment is down? It is one thing that we’re trying ahead to seeing what occurs within the revisions. The revisions have been final – final 12 months – there is a benchmark revision subsequent week.
Final 12 months, the revision was greater than 1,000,000 during the last 12 months. That is why we’d like new and higher knowledge.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Properly, we’ll wait to see if these jobs are created.
I need to ask you in regards to the Fed, as a result of the president, you have been standing subsequent to him within the Oval Workplace, stated he would possibly principally make you one of the crucial highly effective males on the planet, as a result of he is contemplating you to develop into the subsequent chairman of the Federal Reserve.
Our CBS polling we simply did exhibits that 70 % of People need the Federal Reserve to make selections independently from President Trump. However there is a massive partisan distinction right here; 59 % of Republicans say the Fed ought to be guided by what Trump desires, 41 % ought to be unbiased of Trump. Which Republican camp do you fall into?
KEVIN HASSETT: Oh, if I have been in that survey, then I’d say one hundred pc that financial coverage, Federal Reserve financial coverage must be absolutely unbiased of political affect and…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Together with from President Trump?
KEVIN HASSETT: Together with from President Trump.
The actual fact is that we have checked out nations which have allowed the leaders to take over the central banks, and what tends to occur is that it is a recipe for inflation and distress for shoppers. And so Central Financial institution independence is one thing that – as you noticed, there was a listening to this week about that, that Democrats and Republicans and the White Home all agreed about.
Now, the query is, has the present Central Financial institution been as unbiased as we wish, as clear we might as we wish? And I feel that there is some dispute about that, which we might go into if you would like.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Properly, Secretary Bessent went into that in an article in “The Wall Road Journal” this previous week.
KEVIN HASSETT: He did.
MARGARET BRENNAN: He talked in regards to the Central Financial institution’s independence being underneath risk attributable to mission creep. There ought to be an unbiased, non partisan overview of your entire Fed, its position in regulation, financial coverage and analysis.
What’s your plan to overtake the Fed?
KEVIN HASSETT: Properly, I haven’t got a plan to overtake the Fed proper now. I am simply comfortable to do my job.
MARGARET BRENNAN: It’s a must to have been fascinated about it.
KEVIN HASSETT: Look, I’ve been the president’s – one among his prime financial advisers for 9 years. We speak about every little thing from golf to adorning the Oval Workplace to financial coverage, however, proper now, what I am targeted on is doing my job as Director of Nationwide Financial Council every single day.
MARGARET BRENNAN: However you’d endorse what Secretary Bessent wrote in that article absolutely?
KEVIN HASSETT: Sure, I agree along with his article, sure.
MARGARET BRENNAN: And you’d be ready to implement that imaginative and prescient for the Federal Reserve if you’re chair?
KEVIN HASSETT: It is a hypothetical, that – we’ll see.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Properly, it definitely appears, from one of many political appointees, the Cupboard member, to be a imaginative and prescient for the way forward for the Fed that the Trump administration would really like.
KEVIN HASSETT: Proper. Oh, I – I agree – I agree along with his imaginative and prescient, however I look ahead to the president deciding who’s going to be the Federal Reserve Chair. And I feel that he and Secretary Bessent will do this ably. There are a number of nice candidates.
MARGARET BRENNAN: What’s going to you do if the Supreme Court docket does rule that the president’s tariff coverage, or at the very least these underneath the IEEPA, the Worldwide Emergency Financial Powers Act, will not be authorized?
KEVIN HASSETT: We – we definitely do not anticipate the Supreme Court docket to do this. And I feel that we’re on fairly excessive floor. And so it is a most unlikely situation.
However the truth is that there are different authorized authorities that one might use to get the identical final result. 232s, 301s, you recognize, numbers that we might go into should you like.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Different methods to implement tariffs.
KEVIN HASSETT: But it surely could be like, sure, too – too deep a dive for the present on a Sunday.
MARGARET BRENNAN: All proper.
KEVIN HASSETT: However – however, sure, there are different issues that might occur ought to it go that method.
MARGARET BRENNAN: All proper, Kevin Hassett, thanks for coming on this Sunday morning.
KEVIN HASSETT: Thanks. It is nice to be right here.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Face the Nation can be again in a minute. Stick with us.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: We’re joined now by the highest Democrat on the Senate Intelligence Committee, Mark Warner.
Good morning, Senator.
SENATOR MARK WARNER (D-Virginia): Good morning.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Good to have you ever right here in particular person.
You might be identified on your Intel work, however you are additionally on quite a lot of different committees. We have been simply there speaking in regards to the economic system. Do you agree that, principally, the financial knowledge that the USA releases is doubtlessly basically flawed?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: No, I feel that the BLS has been the gold commonplace for years, seen not solely on this nation, however around the globe.
May there be reforms? Completely. But it surely’s a bit ironic that you simply’re firing the referee, the president firing the top, reducing the workers. I am unsure how that’s going to enhance the standard of the info.
And the president had promised that – a golden age from American employees. We’re down 80,000 manufacturing jobs for the reason that starting of his time period. We’re at principally a flat hiring place. And what I feel households who’re listening, if anyone’s bought a household, a member of the family that is in faculty or instantly getting out of faculty, you recognize what a tricky job market is to search out this.
And one of many issues I want to have heard from Kevin and, frankly, from extra economists is, we’re about to see the most important job dislocation in our historical past, I consider, by way of A.I. job dislocation. And people are many occasions form of a – college-driven jobs.
I imply, suppose again 5 years in the past, we stated to each child, if you wish to get a superb job, go develop into a pc programmer.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Proper.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: These are going to be a few of the first jobs ignored and eradicated.
And so I simply – I am fearful that this give attention to who’s retaining rating, after I suppose the American public understand the job market is hard, and significantly by way of manufacturing jobs, there isn’t a golden age.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Properly, and there is additionally a elementary remaking of the economic system should you’re speaking about synthetic intelligence.
So, on that time shortly, there have been greater than a dozen tech titans on the White Home this week, together with a few of these giants within the synthetic intelligence area, Microsoft’s founder, Invoice Gates, Google CEO, Apple CEO, and so they have been throughout the desk praising President Trump for the funding in chip manufacturing and A.I.
Do you deserve – do you suppose he does deserve that reward?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: Properly, I can inform you, the chip manufacturing took place due to a invoice that John Cornyn and I put in underneath Biden, the CHIPS infrastructure act…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Bipartisan.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: … with the $52 billion, completely bipartisan. President Trump has been very occasions important of that invoice. Now he’s, I feel, sending a little bit of a blended message, as a result of a few of the investments in that invoice have been going to Intel, our final which means – significant fabricator of chips.
He took an fairness stake there, which is debatable, though I do suppose getting a few of the earnings…
(CROSSTALK)
MARGARET BRENNAN: Taxpayers personal 10 % of the corporate now.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: Sure.
However the – this is the bizarre factor. Whereas he is attempting to assist American chip manufacturing, on the identical time, he is taken off any of the restrictions on, for instance, Nvidia H20 chips to promote to China. So, what – – how can we learn this? If we need to say we need to construct American capability, Intel, sure, make certain we preserve our lead towards China, properly, why promote a few of our most cutting-edge chips to China?
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: It’s a full contradiction in – in coverage.
MARGARET BRENNAN: And the White Home says, oh, they are not nice chips, so, due to this fact we are able to – can promote them. That is what the commerce secretary has stated.
However on – on the Intelligence beat, because the vice chairman of the Intelligence Committee, you will have an oversight authority, and underneath legislation, the Intel businesses should inform that committee about their operations. The CIA has to inform you about covert actions. This is a crucial form of oversight.
However, this previous week, you stated you have been blocked from even attending a gathering on the Nationwide Geospatial-Intelligence Company out in Virginia. Why do you suppose you have been blocked? And has your Republican counterpart promised you that this is not going to proceed?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: I’ve accomplished these visits to our intel services for the ten plus years I’ve both been chair or vice chair of the Intelligence Committee. They’re a part of the conventional course. You get an opportunity to see the work pressure the place they’re working. You get to see the brand new – latest, finest, coolest stuff.
And, oftentimes, I get to do a city corridor assembly, as a result of I am not solely the chair or vice chair, however many of those services are in Virginia.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Proper.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: So, this – this assembly had been on the books for actually weeks, regular course of enterprise.
This very uncommon particular person Laura Loomer, who’s a right-wing blogger who’s so controversial that the Trump administration did not even put her in – of their Cupboard or – and she or he has been a 9/11 denier. She’s been a virulent anti – anti-Muslim particular person. She has been an enormous proponent of working with white nationalists.
But she appears to have the ear of President Trump. So, his first nationwide safety adviser…
MARGARET BRENNAN: She speaks to Cupboard members, together with the secretary of state.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: Properly, his first nationwide safety adviser bought kicked out as a result of she went after him. The top of the Nationwide Safety Company, who I noticed with – not too long ago, Common Tim Haugh, bought fired. She claimed that firing.
Lately, we have seen 37 senior intel facility people lose their – their safety classification, which principally places them out of a job. And she or he brags about all this on her weblog. I imply, it actually raises the query, is she really the appearing secretary of protection or secretary of conflict as of this morning?
Is she the actual director of nationwide intelligence? What she went after me on was one thing unrelated to this, and stated, why can we let some anti- Trump particular person in to an intelligence facility? Surprisingly sufficient, Tuesday evening, my assembly was canceled.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: No, we’re not going to face up for that. I’ve talked to my Republican colleagues. I feel you’ll…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Proper. Is Tom Cotton promising you this may not occur once more?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: I’ll get these conferences held. I’ve raised it with Cotton. I’ve raised it with the opposite Intelligence members.
You need to speak about one thing that’s harmful, you limit Congress’ capacity to do oversight, significantly with this administration, then we’re flying blind. And within the intelligence area, particularly, not each member can do that. These of us who’re senior on the Intel Committee, we’re the restricted numbers. We’re the eyes and the ears of the remainder of the Senate to do that oversight.
They attempt to limit this, America can be much less protected. And we’ll – I’ll get these conferences.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, inform me about this marketing campaign, it will appear, in Latin America, with the USA taking out this drug boat.
Secretary Rubio, your former colleague on the Senate Intelligence Committee says – quote – “In case you’re on a ship stuffed with cocaine or fentanyl or no matter headed to the USA, you are a right away risk to the USA.” He’s saying that could be a nationwide safety justification to hold out a marketing campaign with an unclear timeline.
Have you ever reached out to Rubio about this? Are you aware something about how it’s being formulated right here with the intelligence neighborhood?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: Properly, to begin with, the Maduro regime in Venezuela are unhealthy guys, and we clearly must do all we are able to to cease fentanyl.
We’ve got not been briefed on this. This was a DOD – it was not an intel venture. It was a DOD venture. However my worry is, there are nonetheless worldwide legal guidelines of the ocean about how the method of interdicting these form of boats – there’s alleged to be a firing of a warning shot. You are alleged to attempt to take it peacefully.
My understanding, this boat, none of these procedures have been adopted. And I’ll get the total transient this week. However what I am frightened about is, if we put our sailors in hurt’s method by violating worldwide legislation, until there may be the suitable designations, might this come again and – and damage these sailors? The sailors have been doing their job.
MARGARET BRENNAN: However, so far as you recognize, that is absolutely a navy operation; it’s not utilizing the intelligence belongings of the intelligence…
SENATOR MARK WARNER: Properly, now we have not…
MARGARET BRENNAN: As a result of the administration says they know everybody who was on that boat. That they had nice readability and constancy.”
SENATOR MARK WARNER: Properly, I want to see that knowledge.
However this, once more, goes to the purpose this sort of motion ought to be briefed to the intelligence neighborhood. And I am a member of what is referred to as the Gang of Eight. These are the oldsters which can be alleged to get absolutely the secret stuff that solely the president will get. I’ve gotten no briefing.
MARGARET BRENNAN: No briefing on this?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: No briefing on this.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Are they conducting common information-sharing with Gang of Eight?
SENATOR MARK WARNER: There are information-sharing. The extent of sharing and the timeliness of the sharing, we…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: For instance, we have been – on the Iran bombings, we weren’t notified beforehand. My Republican colleagues have been notified.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: If you begin making oversight and who will get shared data on a partisan foundation, the…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR MARK WARNER: This type of cooking the books and intelligence, how we bought into the conflict in Iraq within the first place.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Senator Warner, thanks on your time right now.
We’ll be proper again with much more Face the Nation, so stick with us.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: Our Norah O’Donnell spoke not too long ago with Supreme Court docket Justice Amy Coney Barrett for CBS Sunday Morning.
Coney’s new ebook is “Listening to the Regulation: Reflections on the Court docket and Structure.”
Here is a part of their dialog.
(Start VT)
NORAH O’DONNELL: This court docket has issued stays or restricted injunctions in circumstances concerning birthright citizenship, overseas help funding freezes, federal work pressure discount.
Will you – are you able to reply that query? Do these repeated emergency or shadow docket interventions by the Supreme Court docket danger undermining public belief, particularly if they’re perceived to be politically motivated and favorable to President Trump?
AMY CONEY BARRETT (U.S. Supreme Court docket Affiliate Justice): Properly, I feel that the purpose of the ebook is that justices and judges, I need to embrace all federal judges on this, are deciding issues on the deserves.
And I feel that, to the extent that any resolution makes us unpopular, that is a part of the value of the job. We’ve got to make our greatest judgment about what the legislation requires. And, generally, that may imply that the chief department succeeds in litigation and generally not.
But it surely’s not our job to look throughout the docket and say, oh, we need to even issues out in order that generally the chief department wins some, generally it loses some. That is the antithesis of what our job entails. Our job entails making authorized judgments in regards to the circumstances that come earlier than us. And we actually cannot – I imply, we wish the court docket and I would like the – I would like the general public to have belief within the integrity of the court docket.
However the court docket can by no means change its selections, its judgments about what one of the best – what the correct final result is in an effort to tailor it to public opinion. The court docket’s alleged to render unpopular selections generally, as a result of, generally, the correct authorized reply is not essentially the favored one.
(Finish VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: And you may see extra of Norah’s interview on CBS Mornings tomorrow.
We can be proper again.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: We can be proper again with much more Face the Nation, Senators Roger Marshall and Tammy Duckworth, plus evaluation on our new CBS ballot.
Stick with us.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: Welcome again to FACE THE NATION.
We flip now to Republican Senator Roger Marshall, who joins us this morning from Wichita, Kansas.
Welcome to FACE THE NATION.
So –
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL (R-KS): Margaret, nice to with you. I do know it will be an important dialogue.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure. I do know you have been an OB/GYN in apply for, you recognize, many years earlier than you ran for workplace. This previous week the HHS secretary underwent intense questioning from each Democratic lawmakers and a few of your fellow Republicans who have been additionally docs.
Take a pay attention.
(BEGIN VC)
SENATOR JOHN BARRASSO (R-WY): Secretary Kennedy, in your affirmation hearings you promised to uphold the very best requirements for vaccines. Since then, I’ve grown deeply involved.
SENATOR JAMES LANKFORD (R-OK): I’d say successfully we’re denying folks vaccine.
(END VC)
MARGARET BRENNAN: I imply that is – that is the Republican whip and that’s the chair of the committee, Invoice Cassidy. Why do you suppose they’re off base of their concern?
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Look, President Trump selected Robert F. Kennedy Jr. to a disruptor to the CDC. And that is precisely what he is doing. He is targeted on making the CDC extra clear, to make it extra reliable proper now. Proper now People do not belief the CDC. So, he’s actually turning that place the wrong way up.
I respect what my colleagues are saying. However I feel that, you recognize, this complete problem right now, or in that assembly, was about vaccines. In my humble opinion, not each particular person wants each vaccine. And I do not suppose there may be many youngsters on the market that want 76 jabs by the point they’re sufficiently old to vote. However earlier than you label me a non-vaxxer particular person, look, I’ve raised cash for polio vaccinations. The MMR is a superb vaccine. It saved hundreds of lives. Vaccines general have saved a whole lot of tens of millions of lives.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: However not each particular person wants each vaccine. And we simply need to empower mother and father and the docs to make nice selections.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK. I simply need to unpack a couple of belongings you stated there and simply very – as a result of we need to be very cautious on this very heated setting.
If you say you will have an issue with trusting the CDC, it was only a few weeks in the past a gunman walked on to the CDC campus in Atlanta and shot the place up.
Do you care to reply to that, and do you suppose that we must be cautious once we are discussing the CDC and public well being officers proper now?
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Properly, look, in fact I condemn that capturing. However the – the insecurity within the CDC goes again to what the CDC did throughout Covid. They – they misguided us, perhaps lied to us even, in regards to the origins of Covid and how you can deal with it as properly. And the vaccine, they – they overpromised what the vaccine might do as properly. So, that is the place the mistrust is.
And now Bobby Kennedy is in there attempting to scrub up that mistrust and attempting to offer American mother and father, and grandparents and the docs the correct data, clear data, to make good selections.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK. OK. However simply earlier than we speak about different vaccines, particular to Covid and what you simply stated. With the CDC it was – the pandemic was in the course of the Trump administration. It started in the course of the Trump administration. And Operation Warp Velocity was a presidential directive by – by Trump, which a few of your fellow Republicans say he deserves the Nobel Prize for as a result of it stopped the pandemic. So, did you belief the CDC and Operation Warp Velocity underneath President Trump, or are you saying you do not suppose the president deserves the prize for that shot?
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Sure, look, President Trump completely deserves the Nobel Prize. That vaccine saved tens of millions of lives. However that is such a unique time. That is what my buddies –
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK, since you simply stated one thing that sounded very contradictory to that.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: I disagree with you. I feel it is such a unique time right now than it was 5 years in the past. 5 years in the past we had a novel virus. None of us had any immunity to it. It was an odd virus made in a lab in Wuhan, China.
However right now, on common, People have had Covid 5 occasions. We now have pure immunity to it. And never all people wants the vaccine. So, each issues could be true. And that is why when you will have folks that do not perceive science, that do not perceive medication –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Why they do not get it. It was a unique day then than it’s right now.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK. However folks do perceive that once they go into their pharmacy and have an issue getting a shot, as a result of in lots of states they’re now advised they want to return and get a prescription, that the impact right here of the Kennedy insurance policies are making it harder, even when they fall into classes the place they need to be capable to get a shot. You’ll acknowledge that?
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Sure. Sure.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: I feel you are making this fashion, method too sophisticated. That, look, vaccines are a drugs. And identical to you want a prescription to get a GLP-1 –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Proper, however what you stated, he is disrupting. Proper, you stated he is disrupting, however successfully what you have been listening to the Republican whip, John Barrasso, and the Republican Senator Invoice Cassidy speak about was the – the interruption of the provision of vaccines. Cassidy stated, “I’d say successfully we’re denying folks vaccines.” So, that is not Margaret Brennan, that is Invoice Cassidy.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Sure. Look, I disagree. Respectfully disagree. Take into consideration this. What the CDC is now saying is, should you’re over the age of 65, you may have the vaccine. It is fascinating that the U.Okay. and France have stated 75 and 80 because the age. So, all you might want to do is e-mail or name your physician’s nurse and get a prescription and you need to be capable to get it.
In case you’re over the age of six months, you in all probability – it is in all probability a good suggestion to speak to your physician. And all of your nurse has to do is take a look at the chart and says, oh, little Johnny’s bought bronchial asthma, undoubtedly wants the vaccination as properly. So, I feel we’re making this fashion too sophisticated.
Why does all people lose their minds whether or not it involves Covid vaccine? Why cannot we let the physician and the mother and father determine. Let the sufferers determine.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: There’s so many extra vital issues on the market we ought to be speaking about.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Positive.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Continual illnesses.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Twenty % of our adolescents have weight problems, psychological well being issues and – and – and are underneath prescribed drugs. There’s so many extra issues to speak about than simply Covid vaccines.
MARGARET BRENNAN: No, however I feel we’re conflating a couple of issues, together with the operational facet of this. I feel folks get pissed off with their insurance coverage firms. I feel folks get pissed off with their pharmacies and the implementation of well being coverage. And you recognize that that is extra sophisticated than simply saying we’re – we’re altering a couple of issues right here. There are massive implications. And I need to speak to you about it since you stated you just like the MMR vaccine, you want DPT, polio, smallpox. You do not like hepatitis b, which is a liver an infection, and you do not suppose new child children me to be vaccinated towards it.
Senator Cassidy, who’s a liver physician, stated he handled poor and underserved sufferers and that it may be a life-altering situation for the remainder of your life. So, why is not it a compelling argument to you that this ought to be accessible?
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Sure. So, I delivered a child – I delivered a child every single day for – for 25 years. We did a hepatitis check on each one among my sufferers. On the time of supply, if that mother has a destructive hepatitis check, she’s in a secure, monogamous relationship, she’s not doing IV medication, she’s not letting her child going to play in a sandbox stuffed with used needles, then there’s zero probability that that child’s going to have hepatitis.
Now, there’s different mothers that – or different infants that do want it, OK? We must be extra particular. We won’t be overly prescriptive. If that mother has not had prenatal care, if she’s an IV drug abuser, if she’s not in a secure relationship, a complete lot of causes, however we have to choose and select. Not each child wants the hepatitis vaccine. And particularly on day primary. What are these vaccines doing to – to –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Positive.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: To mess with the immune system of – of that exact child as properly?
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: So, that is my concern. So not each child wants hepatitis b vaccine.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK. And I perceive it may also be unfold from – in a family sharing toothbrushes or razors or, for instance, if her companion was not monogamous, the pregnant woman, for instance.
However – however I hear your level right here, that you really want this to be extra bespoke, like, extra choosing and selecting. However others would argue right here that – that in doing that you’re going to drive down immunization charges general should you create broader doubt in vaccines. And that it is a slippery slope right here. Are you in any respect involved that that’s going to be the takeaway?
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Look, Anthony Fauci did extra to create vaccine hesitancy than Bobby Kennedy will do in his 4 years or eight years, nonetheless lengthy he’s the secretary. That is the place the issue is. So, do not blame Bobby Kennedy for the issues created by Anthony Fauci.
However this – however I am simply telling you, mother and father right now need extra data.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I am asking you about what you stated in regards to the hepatitis b vaccine.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: I am sorry. Go forward once more.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I wasn’t speaking about Bobby Kennedy, or Secretary Kennedy, I used to be speaking about you and what you stated in regards to the hepatitis b vaccine and are you involved that choosing and selecting these items like this, this bespoke idea of giving extra alternative, that it additionally has the impact of undermining confidence in vaccines?
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Sure, I feel this can be a massive distinction between Democrats and Republicans. Democrats need a one measurement matches all prescription for everyone. And I am telling you, not all people reads the – reads the ebook, does precisely like that. I’ve confidence in docs, in nurses and fogeys and grandparents to make these selections. I do not suppose that we must always have one authorities coverage that dictates each one among these vaccines. I feel native coverage, native colleges, in the event that they need to have necessities, what Florida did was a bridge too far.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: However how about just a bit widespread sense. Just a bit widespread sense would go an extended methods right here.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK. OK. As a result of President Trump stated he had some doubts about that Florida assertion you simply talked about there, too, and that he likes a number of vaccines.
Earlier than I allow you to go, Secretary Kennedy based this group that’s arguing that girls taking Tylenol or acetaminophen could be placing their infants in danger. They declare there is a hyperlink to neurodevelopmental problems. Would you’re taking – inform a pregnant girl to take a Tylenol and never really feel frightened about it?
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Look, Tylenol is a class b drug. I’ve given it to numerous sufferers. It is on the authorised – authorised listing.
However that being stated, I attempt to inform my sufferers not – my pregnant ladies to not take something as a result of, you recognize, we do not know what we do not know. I am very cautious. You already know, why –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: Why do 20 % of our youngsters have some kind of a psychological well being sickness proper now? Why do now we have so many peanut allergic reactions? Why do now we have so many individuals with autoimmune illnesses?
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: I – we – so, we do not know. What we do not know, we do not know. And I would like gold commonplace research to assist us determine this out and kind it out.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR ROGER MARSHALL: However so far as I do know, Tylenol is OK in being pregnant.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Thanks, Senator. We’ll go away it there for right now.
We’ll be proper again.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: And we’re joined now by Democratic Senator Tammy Duckworth. She joins us this morning from Schaumburg, Illinois.
Good morning to you, Senator.
SENATOR TAMMY DUCKWORTH (D-IL): Good morning.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, you attended, as I perceive it, an illustration yesterday in Chicago the place hundreds of individuals have been out on the road protesting President Trump’s vow to ship in immigration brokers. I do know he is additionally posted on social media suggesting troops will go in. Quote, “Chicago is about to search out out why it’s referred to as the Division of Battle.”
Vice President Vance says there aren’t plans to ship in troops. Do you will have concrete indication now that there are plans to take action?
SENATOR TAMMY DUCKWORTH: Let’s make it clear, the president of the USA primarily simply declared conflict on a serious metropolis in his personal nation. This isn’t regular, Margaret. This isn’t acceptable habits.
No, we have no indications of them on the point of ship troops into Chicago. The truth is, I used to be out at Nice Lakes base yesterday, naval coaching base, and so they have been capable of affirm that the one help they’ve been requested to offer is simply workplace area for ICE, however that there are not any barracks, no detention services, none of that’s being requested or ready to – in an effort to assist troops into Chicago.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So – so then is that this simply, you recognize, social media trash- speak? If you say he is declaring conflict, is that this tongue-in-cheek?
SENATOR TAMMY DUCKWORTH: I feel he is renaming the Division of Protection the Division of Battle. And did he not simply say that Chicago will discover out what it means to be at conflict? I – I do not – I take what the president of the USA says very critically as a result of that’s the respect you must give to the workplace. And if that is what he is declaring, then let me make it clear, it will be an unlawful order to declare conflict on main metropolis, any metropolis, inside the USA by the president of the USA.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Senator, I do know you simply talked about you went out to the Nice Lakes naval coaching session – station, I ought to say, and also you stated, the navy management stated they’re going to solely get workplace area. ICE can not herald deadly munitions. And the assets won’t be diverted from navy coaching. So, all of that collectively, did you breathe a sigh of aid and say this may not have an actual influence on the navy?
SENATOR TAMMY DUCKWORTH: Properly, we’ll make it possible for there’s not an influence on the navy. We have to make it possible for as, you recognize, Nice Lakes naval coaching base is the place each single recruit in the USA Navy goes via to get their fundamental coaching, after which afterward some superior coaching. We have to make it possible for not a single greenback, not a single penny of the assets that they’ve there ought to be – that ought to be directed in the direction of coaching our nation’s sailors and making them able to do their jobs. None of that cash must be diverted in an effort to assist ICE or any of Donald Trump’s political, you recognize, theater efforts. We have to give attention to ensuring we prove the perfect sailors we probably can out of the bottom.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, by way of how Democrats are responding to this rhetoric, “The Chicago Tribune” faulted Governor Pritzker for his threats to, quote, “not stand idly by if the Guard went in.” They wrote, “what does that risk really imply? How a few dialog earlier than the motion or the response as a result of it is all doubtlessly dangerous to collective well being.” It appears like there’s a number of stress right here. Is there a chance to work with the administration to keep away from making this worse?
SENATOR TAMMY DUCKWORTH: Properly, they’ve not – they’ve not responded to any of our requests. I imply, I will provide you with a really concrete instance. Senator Durbin, myself, Senator – Congressman Schneider despatched a request into DHS to ask them to clarify what precisely are you going to be doing at Nice Lakes, and might we come take a look at your facility so now we have a greater understanding of what your operations are, and so they replied, no, you may’t, and, in truth, gave their workers the day without work on the day that we went to go take a look at the services and locked the doorways and left the bottom. Principally, they fled the bottom. This isn’t the motion of somebody that is doing one thing authorized or that they’re – that they are pleased with. They actually gave the folks the day without work, locked the doorways and left.
Now, the Navy allowed us on to the publish. They allowed us to tour the skin of the ability and likewise the place they’d be storing the non-lethal munitions. However DHS didn’t present up.
And we definitely have despatched the administration a number of inquiry about what they’re planning on doing, who’re they bringing into Chicago. Are they planning to carry the Nationwide Guard in. They’ve none – none of that. They’ve not even reached out to native legislation enforcement to attempt to coordinate. You already know, in the event that they have been really, really all in favour of combating crime, then they’d work with native legislation enforcement and ask them, what do you want? What assist do you want? And we have not gotten any, any communications or suggestions from the administration in anyway.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I need to ask you, in your armed providers position, about what’s a significance geopolitical assembly this previous week. You had a number of America’s adversaries gathering collectively. Vladimir Putin, Xi Jinping, Kim Jong-un of North Korea, all of them in Beijing. And China and Russia gave the impression to be deepening their work collectively. What do you suppose the sign to the USA right here is?
MARGARET BRENNAN: The sign to the USA is – is strictly what, you recognize, these authoritarian regimes need to ship, which is that they’re the brand new world energy, that America is shedding its floor, and that they’ve utter disrespect for the USA. I feel it was very, very clear. And it, you recognize, it would not escape me the truth that as soon as this assembly occurred, which was humiliating to Donald Trump, he instantly responds by saying, properly, then I’ll rename the Division of Protection the Division of Battle and declare conflict in Chicago.
That is what Donald Trump does. When one thing unhealthy goes – occurs to him within the information cycle, or when the Epstein victims come collectively and have a really emotional press convention, he modifies the subject and distracts us by saying issues like, I’ll ship ICE into Chicago, I am going to do that or do this. The American folks can’t be fooled. We can’t be – permit him to distract us from what is actually occurring, which is, this can be a man who has pushed our economic system to some extent the place now there are extra unemployed folks than there are jobs. You already know, we’re not promoting our agricultural merchandise abroad. And our adversaries are united towards us.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Properly, the unemployment price remains to be low. However I hear you on a weaker than anticipated jobs quantity.
Simply in a short time, there was navy motion taken in America’s yard by the Trump administration. Vice President Vance says, “killing cartel members who poison our fellow residents is the very best and finest use of our navy.” He was speaking a few strike on a drug boat – alleged drug boat off the coast of Venezuela. What do you make of that present of pressure?
SENATOR TAMMY DUCKWORTH: It was an unlawful transfer by the Trump administration. There’s a factor referred to as due course of on this nation, and that wanted to have occurred. And the truth that it occurred in worldwide order – in worldwide waters really opens People to an identical motion by our adversaries. You simply – we have been simply speaking about Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping and getting collectively and exhibiting a present of pressure towards the USA. Properly, there’s nothing now to cease them from doing one thing like that towards People in worldwide waters.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Sure.
SENATOR TAMMY DUCKWORTH: And it might be civilians. And so they might say, you recognize what, these have been drug boats. We’re simply going to go forward and blow them out of the water.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Properly –
SENATOR TAMMY DUCKWORTH: You already know, he is setting a priority right here that places People in peril.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Senator Duckworth, thanks on your time this morning.
We’ll be proper again.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: We’re again now with our govt director of elections and surveys, Anthony Salvanto, for extra perception on right now’s CBS Information ballot.
So, Anthony, let’s begin on the economic system. That jobs report for August was decrease than anticipated. Inflation is down from its post-Covid peak, nevertheless it’s nonetheless not at that 2 % stage the Fed desires to get to.
How are folks feeling?
ANTHONY SALVANTO: Earlier this week I requested folks, choose one phrase to explain the economic system. And the highest one they picked was “unsure.” And also you see right here, I feel tariffs are an enormous a part of that. We have already seen 4 in ten folks inform us they’re reducing again on spending due to will increase from costs that they see as a part of tariffs. They suppose tariffs are going to lift costs in each the brief time period and the long run. And a part of that’s assist for imposing new tariffs has been ticking down. It’s now down once more. More and more confined simply to the president’s base, to Republicans.
Now, there may be their view that it’s going to in the end improve manufacturing jobs within the U.S., that individuals should be keen to pay a bit bit extra to assist President Trump’s insurance policies, however that view has not permeated past that base to the broader public, Margaret.
MARGARET BRENNAN: And we would want to attend till we see that job development in these areas.
ANTHONY SALVANTO: Sure, I imply it might be, in some methods, that pull again a bit little bit of main indicator as we go ahead, proper? Individuals spending. The opposite a part of this, too, is extra broadly. And we speak about who and the place you may impose tariffs. After we speak about affect on the Federal Reserve, a presidential affect there, the lens of that is additionally about presidential energy and the way a lot affect a president can have over these levers on the economic system.
And, you recognize, I requested about this a bit. And what we’re seeing is, Republicans very snug with Donald Trump having these levers. Different People, not a lot.
MARGARET BRENNAN: However that is uncommon for conservatives particularly who’ve, for therefore lengthy, trumpeted free market economic system, not a centrally deliberate one. So actually liking that there’s such management within the arms of a political chief is admittedly uncommon. That is a change.
ANTHONY SALVANTO: Properly, it’s within the sense that should you look again at polling over generations you’d see Republicans, free markets, much less authorities management. Right here, a lot of it, like so many issues, facilities round their belief in President Trump for that. However you additionally see a few of these splits inside Republicans the place the MAGA base, they describe it as being environment friendly, and plenty of others describing it as, you are proper, simply extra management.
MARGARET BRENNAN: And it’s that MAGA base that has reshaped your entire get together.
ANTHONY SALVANTO: Certainly.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, that is what we imply actually once we speak Republican today.
Let me ask you in regards to the Nationwide Guard. This does appear to unify Republicans, if I perceive it, out of your polling. The give attention to immigration and legislation enforcement. This surge of federal assets to D.C. He is speaking about Portland and Chicago and Boston and Baltimore. What is the notion of it?
ANTHONY SALVANTO: Properly, the lens on this touches on views of crime and what’s efficient of combating crime, but in addition on rights and freedoms. Sure, for proponents of this, lots of them Republicans, they’re saying it is successfully about combating crime. They are saying they’d assist deploying the Nationwide Guard to different cities, such as you talked about. Even to their very own space, whether or not there’s Democratic-run areas or Republican-run areas.
However for almost all, who’re in opposition to this, in precept, they are saying, properly, it will impose on rights and freedoms. It should make these rights and freedoms much less safe, right here once more, via the lens of presidential energy. The general public usually would see form of to the native leaders, the governor and the president all concerned. One factor to notice, and I feel it is associated, talking of the Republican base, the president’s general approval ranking is ticked up from July. It is up two factors. And it is stabilized after having steadily declined over these early weeks and months of his time period. That is actually helped purchase Republicans.
And also you take a look at how folks consider the president. Republicans say they’re evaluating him extra on immigration, deportation, crime, these points. People who find themselves evaluating him extra on the economic system, on inflation give him general decrease scores.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Anthony Salvanto, thanks.
ANTHONY SALVANTO: Thanks.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We’ll be again in a second.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: It is a unhappy morning for these of us right here at FACE THE NATION as we realized that the long-time affiliate director, Mary Frances Sirianne, has handed away. She was right here with a smile on her face each Sunday morning for many years earlier than she retired in 2020.
For FACE THE NATION, I am Margaret Brennan.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
